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Another DAM Podcast interview with Jonathan Phillips about Digital Asset Management


Henrik de Gyor:   This is Another DAM Podcast about Digital Asset Management. I’m Henrik de Gyor. Today I’m speaking with Jonathan Phillips. Jonathan, how are you?

Jonathan Phillips:   Pretty good.

Henrik de Gyor:   Jonathan, how are you involved with Digital Asset Management?

Jonathan Phillips:  Well, I currently run two separate Digital Asset Management systems. My former company, that I worked for fifteen years at, we merged with a larger corporation and so currently I’m running the old Digital Asset Management system as well as taking on the newer Digital Asset Management system and I’m running part of the integration of the two systems, which is quite an undertaking I must say. It’s been a year so far and we’re about a third of the way through.

I came into Digital Asset Management probably about sixteen years ago. I actually came to it through graphic design and actually more precisely Photoshop. I was hired as a production and graphic artist and when I was there I quickly moved over to retouching the portfolio of hotel images that we had. And as you can imagine that’s probably one of our key marketing assets of the actual different properties and it was being underutilized greatly at that time in 2002.

So through the photography work, I then actually took on the role of art directing different shoots at different properties and that became a photography program for the properties. This led, actually at the same exact time, into an existing DAM system that they had, which was very rudimentary. It had some photos, a couple of logos in it and that was really where I first got my toes wet. And within three years we kept on growing, doing photo shoots and in about three years it took us to really develop into an actual Digital Asset Management system with metadata tagging, data trees, light boxes, you know, all the things that we know about Digital Asset Management at this time.

Within five years of me coming on, we really bulked out and made the photography program into a completely international project that we managed the photo shoots across the globe. In my career, I actually see the creation of digital assets and the management and distribution as part of a single workflow. So in my mind, it’s actually all one and the same. We kept on building on the system and resolving problems as they came up, creating more tools, we built a big web-to-print system, which we would actually change four times since then. And that’s where we’re really going on twelve years now and we’re still going strong.

So I’d have to say Digital Asset Management comes to people in very strange ways, and it can offer so many opportunities and it really has over the last sixteen years.

Henrik de Gyor:   Jonathan, how does a leading global hospitality company use Digital Asset Management?

Jonathan Phillips:   That’s a really good question. I’m not going to talk about the current strategy that we’re still developing. It’s still in the very beginning phases but I can talk about the last sixteen years of my life and building on that. I’d have to say, like I just said, we had a very holistic approach to the creation of assets, the managing of assets and then the distribution. We saw it as really, all in one, the same thing. Digital Asset Management that, as a single, unified creative and production department, where I was.

So as an example, I ran the photography photo shoots and then my team ran the submission process of getting them retouched and into the system. And then the same team managed all of the assets that the tagging, the usage rights, the user groups and accessibility. And then we also ran the distribution out into all of the GDS and OTAs as well as all of our partners. So, and that’s the entire travel agency industry, actually.

So it’s really been a massive undertaking. We also are in the same group creating logos, floor plans, meetings and guestroom floor plans, templates to be used, so all of those assets were really created in the same exact team that was managing the Digital Asset Management system and distributing them.

The creative teams, the Digital Asset Management, the distribution to websites, travel sites, marketing teams, they all worked as one large team with a single overall strategy. And I think this really helped us over the years identifying problems and coming up with the best possible solution that we could come up with in a very fluid way.

We saw Digital Asset Management and the marketing materials that we house as kind of an ongoing part of the creative process itself. So the managing tools that facilitated that creation was also the same as housing and the overall use of the asset itself. It’s quality, consistency, and distribution. It’s all one and the same. So for a company that’s selling any types of goods or services and the hotel business is actually doing both at the same time, it’s the market assets are the lifeblood of the company.

There’s nothing more precious than how the world will perceive us and the brand so I’ve spent a lot of time balancing the smallest, little tiny technical details and balancing that with the larger strategy of the hotel business as a whole. So we are always working across the international enterprise to streamline, to make changes, to meet the needs in a rapidly changing marketing world. And I just wake up at night and I just hope that the tools that we’re putting into place are going to hold up in the long run or as long as it possibly can. So it does keep me up at night.

Managing the Digital Asset Management system itself; there’s a lot of time that I spend talking to the customers, helping the customers, resolving problems with the customers and constantly making notes to make sure that the tools are working optimally and meeting the needs of the customers, which is the marketing and the different properties, the ownerships and our partners.

We use a range of really tech savvy managers out in a field, as well as people at the properties that rarely even get on a computer. So we’re always kind of bouncing ideas and the tools themselves off of that very diverse audience and the tool has to work for everybody. So that’s really, kind of the cornerstone of what we do here. I mean, there’s a lot of tools out there, and wow, it’s amazing that the technology that’s out these days. It’s matured in the last few years even, in incredible ways.

I mean, there’s just unbelievable things that are just really science fiction out there, from a few years ago. And finding the solutions that actually meet the goals of our company is really where this skill set comes in. I mean, we could look at out of the box solutions. We have constant debates over configuration versus customization. That’s, oh my god, I could go on for hours just about that.

And I found that the overall systems that we’re using, they really do need a lot more customization. I find that a really strong marketing team has really strong and clear needs and they have a great idea in their minds of what they’re looking for and a good system is going to match those needs and really customize and configure to be exactly what they need.

So I’m actually a big proponent here of boutique solutions. Because our routines have such high standards that that’s all they’re going to accept so I put a lot of thought into this as you can tell. There’s a lot of balancing of the client’s needs and getting those needs meet with the technology that’s available and then customizing it in a very specific way. And then of course, there’s always costs that comes down to just about every single project.

Henrik de Gyor:   What are the biggest challenges and successes you’ve seen with Digital Asset Management?

Jonathan Phillips:   Over a large and very diverse enterprise, we’re in 83 countries, we’ve got thousands of hotels and a lot of those are franchise models with properties and ownerships. I see in my world, it’s the creating of consistent quality assets that go into the system that’s always one of the great challenges that we constantly have. I know that’s not a straightforward Digital Asset Management problem but I think that’s a huge issue with any system that comes online. It’s really what goes in, comes out.

There’s the old saying that, garbage in, garbage out. The Digital Asset Management industry, it’s really, that’s the core, is if you get good assets, a semi-good system could survive it. If you got bad assets, nothing’s going to survive. It’s really not going to be useful to the users. So there’s a huge aspect of quality control in everything that we do here and that goes into the system itself making sure that we build a great system and then all the assets that go in are just as good.

More from a Digital Asset Management technology standpoint, I’d say the ongoing battle with that is that things get complicated and they get too complicated too quickly. So constantly keeping it simple. And that’s kind of a mantra we’re always thinking about is keeping it simple. Complexity is going to creep into any system with a large number of assets in it. Once you start tagging you got translations, you have all the categories, you’ve got APIs and distribution. So we try to keep the base data and file structure as simple as we possibly can.

Every time we want to add something simple like, just another asset type, we know the ramifications of that can be massive. So we have a lot of arguments about those sorts of base structure changes and they’re really crucial decisions to us and we do agonize over them. Maybe a little bit too much, but we do. We see that as kind of the philosophical statement of Digital Asset Management is keep it simple because complexity is going to come in by the very nature of managing assets and the number of assets you have to manage.

But you know, another big challenge that I see, that I’m pretty passionate about now that you mention it, is UX: user experience. Any DAM system is just a tool. It’s got users, and the success and failure of the system is the success or failure of the users themselves. The best-programed system, it can be completely a huge failure if the user experience is not taken into account. The UX is a big thing in apps and web design these days. But I think it applies to Digital Asset Management. Personally, I think it applies everywhere. It’s just, it comes down to good design and I think good design can make or break just about anything.

We do a lot of user testing, as much as anybody can. I’ve had some great inspirations working in a department where I’m right next to the creatives. So I’m within earshot of the web designers and the app designers so I do get a lot of influence from them and I steal a lot from them as well honestly, and they know it and they’re proud of it. So really taking an interface and really agonizing over the details of the interface, of where every little detail, every little button, the user experience of what happens when they hit a button, we put as much thought of that into that as we do just about any structural change we do on the back end in the programming.

Programmers don’t always see eye to eye but I’ve always believed that the system really has to act in the way it’s supposed to act and behave in a way that is intuitive.

Henrik de Gyor:   What advice would you like to share with DAM professionals and people aspiring to become DAM professionals?

Jonathan Phillips:   That’s a tough question. Actually, I love mentoring and I think mentoring comes naturally in a situation to situation basis for me. But overall, thinking about it, let’s see. First I’d say always balance a very clear vision of what you want to accomplish and adaptability. You can have great ideas and you can be great at what you do but you have to adapt. You’ve got clients, you’ve got a lot of people who have a lot of opinions and you have to go with the flow. Specifically Digital Asset Management, I try to advise people on my team that you have to know the business that you’re in, that you can know the technology, you can know Digital Asset Management, you can know content management, you can know library science and that’s all great. But if you don’t understand your clients and their needs, you’re really in a hole and you got to dig out of that.

So listen to your clients’ needs. Always coming back to the plan that best meets the needs of your clients and coming up with really creative, streamlined solutions to their needs is where really great Digital Asset Management system and manager come in. So I guess it comes down to being a creative problem solver. That’s probably the second piece of good advice.

You know, I didn’t come into Digital Asset Management in a straight way, and I don’t think most people do. I think most people come to Digital Asset Management from someplace else, be it IT, marketing, or like maybe from a creative background. Yeah, I think everybody who’s in the business feels like they came into it the hardest way possible.

When I got into it in 2002, there really weren’t any resources like there are now. I mean, it’s amazing how much stuff you can just look up and read and keep up on it. But I think I was successful because I listened to my clients and I came up with creative solutions. I really looked at every detail and I made sure that it really worked well. In that way, I think my Bachelor of Science in the Fine Arts with an emphasis on technical illustration by the way, it really came in handy in Digital Asset Management. Coming up with really interesting solutions and I thought that way. And it never hurts that I always tried to go above and beyond. I always tried to meet the expectations and then how do I go beyond that and delight my client. And that’s always been a kind of, internal mantra of mine.

Advice, yeah. It always comes down to creative solutions. I think that’s a good one as well. There’s so much great technology out there and I think it can be really seductive seeing bells and whistles and artificial intelligence and predictive modeling and all this whiz-bang. And you just got to remember that it comes down to users and how do users see the system and how to best meet those goals, before any of the great, amazing technology that’s out there.

And actually speaking about technology, I think the best technology for coming up with ideas is a pencil and paper. I still use a mechanical pencil and a piece of paper whenever I have to think through a problem. I love paper prototyping. I think it’s the fastest way; it’s the best way to come up with really great ideas, is just doodle and scribble down all of your ideas. I doodle up entire pages and then I take post-it notes and I rip them up and I cover different pieces and I put different buttons and I can do it so fast and it’s so intuitive doing it with a pencil. I recommend everybody try to problem solve with just doodling it out on a napkin or a piece of paper. It really is, it might sound old school but I just don’t think there’s a better solution out there for just thinking things through.

And again last thing, going back to the last thing I said in the last question was user experience. It basically trumps everything else, being submitting images or managing or searching a system. It’s how it works and how people react to it. There’s so many resources out there to learn how to really make an interface that is really human and is just intuitive. And that’s another thing, is Digital Asset Management, read up on user experience. It will really, really help you out in the long run. I guess that’s kind of me going back to my artistic roots though and that never goes away. So, there you go.

Henrik de Gyor:   Well, thanks Jonathan.

Jonathan Phillips:   No problem.

Henrik de Gyor:   For more on this, visit If you have any comments or questions, please feel free to e-mail me at Thanks again.

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Another DAM Podcast interview with Frank Chagoya on Digital Asset Management


Here are the questions asked:

  • How are you involved with Digital Asset Management?
  • Why does a multi-national advertising and marketing firm use Digital Asset Management?
  • How does a Digital Asset Management system help you maintain brand consistency?
  • How do you order something in the DAM to maintain that consistency?
  • What advice would you like to share with DAM Professionals and people aspiring to become DAM Professionals?


Henrik de Gyor: [0:02] This is Another DAM Podcast about Digital Asset
Management. I’m Henrik de Gyor. Today I’m speaking with Frank Chagoya.
Frank, how are you?
Frank Chagoya: [0:11] Good, Henrik. How are you today?
Henrik: [0:12] Great. Frank, how are you involved with Digital Asset
Frank: [0:17] For Leo Burnett, I’ve been involved in the original RFPs, evaluation
and selection of the DAM provider for our first implementation. We currently
have several launches of DAMs for a number of our clients. As a global hub
with multinational offices, we needed a vendor that would be able to provide
services and sufficiently support these offices and our client’s needs. I’m also
involved in the ongoing DAM maintenance, development, training, and the
training of our end users, as well.
Henrik: [0:54] Why does a multinational advertising and marketing firm use
Digital Asset Management?
Frank: [0:59] That’s a really good question. Many of our clients are also multinational
and require brand consistency for all their products and campaigns. [1:07]
For example, let’s say we have a client that has a need. A simultaneous launch
of a new product in a major multinational set of markets. This is to coincide with
the release of a major motion picture, so timing is critical.
[1:23] Leo Burnett, as a hub and a brand steward for the creative advertising, will
maintain approved ads and artwork. We provide distribution, as well. Assets can
ordered for distribution or repurposing. This provides a global consistency
and efficiency for the brand management to the client.
[1:43] We also provide the reduced time to market. We provide our clients with
leading edge technology to improve performance for unimpeded access and
fulfillment of their assets globally.
Henrik: [1:57] Frank, how does a Digital Asset Management System help you
maintain brand consistency?
Frank: [2:02] For Leo Burnett as a brand steward for our clients, we provide
the assets that they require for their multinational campaigns. We may provide,
or actually be, the hub for the creative here in Chicago. Then this campaign
launches out into, say other, even third world countries. [2:22] Let’s say the president
of this company comes in and says, “We’re going to do this campaign.”
Here it is in Chicago, they see it printed on a billboard. They want to make sure
that when they step out into, let’s say China, off a plane. They see a billboard of
the exact same ad, that it looks exactly the same.
[2:41] We provide the assets that are distributed, not only for local campaigns,
but multinational campaigns. So that once you have these assets stored in one
place, your client has an adequate resource for redistribution of that particular
[3:01] Even if there’s an image in an ad that’s produced here in the States and
then they want to do another image in another country. It’s not necessary. They
have the ads that were used as originally approved sets of campaign ads. Those
can be redistributed globally.
Henrik: [3:19] Great. Frank, how do you order something in your Digital Asset
Management System to maintain that consistency?
Frank: [3:26] Our system has 24 hour access via the Internet. Obviously, it’s a
secured access that we use to provide to not only our own facilitates, but to
the client as well. Let’s say, the client decides they want to do an ad in China
that they produced here in the States. They can actually look for that ad on the
site. Once they locate it, they can select it, order to their cart, and then they’ll
receive an email with a hot link that says, “This is what you want. You can download
it via secured link.” [4:01] Then even if he doesn’t want to deliver it himself,
he can pass that link onto someone else who has secured access to this site, and
then get these files so that they can repurpose them. Obviously, when they repurpose
it, they’re going to be doing the language change. So we can provide
them not only with the final asset that was actually produced in the States, we
can actually give them a file that’s workable.
[4:25] So that they can manipulate it and make their changes to the local market.
Henrik: [4:29] Great. What advice would you like to share with DAM professionals
and people aspiring to become DAM professionals?
Frank: [4:34] I have lots of advice. [laughs]
Henrik: [4:36] Please.
Frank: [4:39] I think that attending the industry events is a critical given.
Because these venues provide access to knowledgeable people who have the
“been there, done that” experience. My biggest piece of advice is to get into
the mix and get some answers, be part of the network. That’s a very important
part. When you’re doing this, don’t hesitate to ask people questions. All people
that I have had interaction with have been more than happy to lend tips and
advice. [5:10] In fact, you might ask for a cup of sugar, let’s say, and end up with
the entire bag. One of the other things that I have as a major piece of advice
would be, make sure you don’t plan your DAM into a corner. Many people focus
on what they need for a DAM, but don’t quite look at the horizon. I think that
you should make sure that you get what you need for your DAM as you need it
now, but then also make sure that you have plans for its future.
[5:41] Always take a look at what other features might be available, or what you
might need as a business to add to the features of your own DAM. Make sure
that there’s an open door for that future.
Henrik: [5:53] Great advice. Thanks, Frank. For more on this and other
Digital Asset Management topics, log onto
Another DAM Podcast is now available on Audioboom, Blubrry, iTunes and the
Tech Podcast Network. Thanks again.

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Another DAM Podcast interview with Philip Guiliano on Digital Asset Management


Here are the questions asked:

  • How are you involved with Digital Asset Management?
  • How do you use Digital Asset Management when it comes to Brand Change and Brand Management?
  • What advice would you like to share with DAM Professionals and people aspiring to become DAM Professionals?


Henrik de Gyor: [0:02] This is Another DAM Podcast about Digital Asset
Management. I’m Henrik de Gyor. Today I’m speaking with Philip Guiliano.
Philip [0:10] , how are you?
Philip Guiliano: [0:12] I’m very good, thank you.
Henrik: [0:14] Philip, how are you involved with Digital Asset Management?
Philip: [0:16] BrandActive is a brand implementation and management company.
This means that we get involved in large scale mergers, acquisitions, large
scale rebranding programs, and managements of brands that currently exist in
the market. [0:31] Our role is to be involved in the transition and management
of every single asset that a company has, from signage to vehicles to branded
environments, retail locations, documents, forms, uniforms, IT systems anything
that you can think of that is a physical or digital asset that carries the name,
logo, colors, any identity element of a brand.
[0:52] Our role is not to create the brand strategy or design. We don’t do any
of that creative development work. Our role is truly the implementation and
[1:01] What that means is, through our process of scoping out the brand change,
through doing a detailed inventory of what are all of these assets around the
globe that the company controls. How do they manage that transition? What
are they going to do with each individual asset? What’s the project organization
look like, and how do you manage that process?
[1:22] Through that process, we gather tons of pictures, tons of examples, tons
of video, all of their current assets, as they exist today templates, files, all of
that. We gather a lot of robust data around the inventory, the cost elements, all
of that stuff that is related to those assets how they’re produced, how they’re
designed, how they’re procured.
[1:46] We put that into database systems. We then work with our clients to create
the workflows, drive those workflows through implementation and on through
brand management.
[1:59] As an organization, when it comes down to the system side, we use systems
internally, for ourselves. We also use systems that are client facing. We do
what we call a “brand implementation and brand management platform” that
drives the implementation of the brand across all these assets.
[2:19] So that’s location rollouts, things of that nature, all of their template refinements
around the globe empowering their employees with templates and processes
that they can use to rebrand their assets as well, or manage their brand
assets as they exist. We get involved in the creation of platforms like that.
[2:38] We also offer a Software as a Service Digital Asset Management platform,
built on the ADAM platform for small-scale and medium-scale clients that want
to get experience and exposure with how Digital Asset Management works,
what it’s capable of, what’s the value in it. We do a pilot test.
[2:55] That platform’s also available for large clients. Some of our larger clients
that are more global will use that platform to do a pilot program for a certain division
within the company or a certain department within the company. From a
systems basis, we do the brand implementation platforms and we do Softwareas-
a-Service DAM.
[3:17] We also do vendor agnostic consulting services, where we will go into a
company and define their requirements, look for a business case for systemization,
lead vendor selection programs, and project manage their implementation.
That’s how BrandActive’s involved.
Henrik: [3:35] How you use Digital Asset Management when it comes to brand
change and brand management.
Philip: [3:40] The way in which we use it is to empower our clients and empower
their employees with managing the very complex assortment of digital
and physical assets that they have. [3:55] I’ll use an example. When we’re going
through a brand implementation with a client that, say, has 60 manufacturing
facilities, 1,000 retail locations, and corporate offices and sales facilities around
the globe, there are lot of different assets that have to be transitioned. There
are all the locations, all the signage, all the vinyl graphics, all the millwork, all of
the documents, forms, everything.
[4:21] What we will do is collect all of this information, we will put it into a system,
and then we will create the workflows for those clients that will drive the transition
of those assets through to completion, so that they actually hit their target
dates. They have full cost visibility and full cost control, vendor management
control, again, across physical and digital asset creation.
[4:43] Their employees have the tools and the templates that they need to take
what is a final created asset and localize that, customize that, change language,
anything that they need to do. From a multilingual, from an asset integration,
from a data integration, across multiple systems anything they need to do in
that area to manage the creation of their digital and their physical assets.
Henrik: [5:10] What advice would you like to share with DAM professionals and
people aspiring to become DAM professionals?
Philip: [5:13] Take your time. [laughs] That’s probably the best [indecipherable
05:16] . Honestly, I see so many programs and so many clients and prospects
that we’re dealing with that understand that they need a DAM solution or a
MRM solution, a MAM solution. [5:31] They understand what they’re doing
currently without tracking, without reporting, without metrics, without visibility
into how they can get operational improvement, without visibility into how
they’re spending their money, and how they could potentially save that money
by systemization.
[5:50] They understand that they need to change that, and they look into a
solution without truly defining their requirements. By that I mean, “What are the
business drivers? What problems are they trying to solve? What are the political
and cultural issues that are going to impede the program acceptance? What
solutions are really going to address their needs?”
[6:10] There are a lot of people that I’ve seen that have evaluated DAM and
MRM based on what seems like excellent functionality, and it is. It’s fantastic
functionality for companies that need that functionality. But the truth of the
matter is that that functionality would never get implemented at their company.
[6:26] They end up picking a vendor that is not actually going to live up to what
they really need. They may be a client that needs amazing customization across
their user interface and across their workflows. They need workflow automation
or they’re not going to live their business case. They end up picking the solution
that doesn’t allow them to be as flexible as they need to be in that area.
[6:47] Taking time to really define a business case for change, really understanding
the business drivers, the metrics, how you’re going to measure success in
the end program, and what you can measure currently to illustrate that success.
Really define your requirements that’s business, technical, functional, every
requirement that you can nail down so that you know what it is you’re evaluating
a vendor based off of, and that you are actually evaluating them based on
your needs.
[7:14] Engaging internal resources is a big one, throughout the process. As
we take people through business case development, and as we take people
through requirements development, we’re engaging resources across every area
of the organization.
[7:28] I definitely recommend doing that because these are the users of your
platform. These are the people that are really going to drive the success of the
platform. The earlier you engage them, the better the program’s going to be.
[7:38] I guess that brings up considering the cultural dynamics, as well. It’s very
similar for us and our brand implementation program. Really understanding the
culture dynamics, knowing what a solution is going to mean to the various users
within the organization, and what is going to stop them from using it.
[7:59] Having a solution alone definitely does not mean that people are going to
use it. Having the solution that isn’t built around the way people work within the
organization is absolutely going to assure they won’t use it.
[8:08] The engagement, training, and customization to the way people work,
understanding the workflows, and how you want to automate them. Definitely
including tracking and reporting, that’s going to be very key not only for acceptance
of the system at a user level but also executive level acceptance, and your
ability to continue to grow the program within the organization, beyond your
initial deployment.
Henrik: [8:33] Great. Thanks, Philip.
Philip: [8:34] Thank you very much. I appreciate the call and definitely appreciate
the time.
Henrik: [8:39] For more on Digital Asset Management, log onto Another DAM Podcast is available on Audioboom,
Blubrry, iTunes, and the Tech Podcast Network. Thanks again.